People living in Europe – especially Western Europe – usually have a very poor opinion about my fellow Romanians, so I decided to try and tackle this delicate subject and try to explain why are Romanians frowned upon in Europe.
In the end, if there are so many countries who frown upon Romanians, they can’t ALL be crazy, right?
The truth is that they are not completely wrong, unfortunately – but the reality they know, the reality they are faced with on a daily basis is just part of the big picture.
Because “Rude Romanians,” “Romanian thieves” and “Romanian scum” are not words that should be used to describe all of us. There are good people and bad people everywhere.
I think that it all started with the “documentary” The Romanians Are Coming which enraged a lot of Romanians because they only showed part of the picture – the ugly part that most of Europe already knows and (which is not, by any means, untrue). It’s just not how things actually are as a whole in this country and among Romania’s population.
It showed the Romanian Gypsies, the beggars, the bad seeds, the black sheep… you get the picture. They took the worst that Romania has to offer in terms of people and made it a rule of thumb.
No, not all Romanians are beggars, not all of them are thieves or just rude, bad people!
Romania is one of the poorest countries in the EU and also one of the least educated countries in Europe.
It has some of the lowest salaries in Europe and many people don’t have electricity or running water, or even a toilet in their house – 1 in 4 actually.
This results in some strange individuals who consider petty crimes a way of living, who have no hopes for a better future and who are unfortunately living on a day by day basis, not even trying to figure out the bigger picture, not even trying to climb up the ladder and turn the odds into their favor.
Many of these people have already left our country and became parasites in Western countries – where there is more to earn, even from their petty crimes or begging.
And even though it is believed that most of them are actually gypsies (the darker skinned Romanians aka the Roma population), that is not the case. It’s not a racial thing at all.
They are still Romanian citizens and a product of this country. Because a country is the sum of its best and worst people.
It’s these people (the worst, the scum, not gypsies as a whole) who manage to paint a dark picture of the Romanians.
I am talking about beggars, thieves, people who consider petty thefts a way of living – the only possible way of living, liars and generally bad people.
We still have these bad people here in Romania too and I am sure that every country has more or fewer of these individuals… they just exist in our society, no matter if we like it or not.
It just happens that many of ours go abroad. They do stupid stuff. They don’t learn. They do it all over again. They’re the Romanians.
And as a result, most people living in those foreign countries believe that ALL Romanians are bad people.
And because of this, Romanians are frowned upon all over Europe. Which is sad and hopefully will change sooner rather than later.
I say this because there are many highly trained and skilled individuals working and living in European countries and all over the world that are not taken into equation.
I’m talking doctors, nurses, engineers and other skilled workers – but it’s not the good people that you hear about, it’s the bad ones. And this really hurts.
And unfortunately the bad Romanians are all over the place for the same reasons why our most skilled people leave the country: because Romania itself is so poor that any other country in Europe would do. For crime or for honest work – it’s just more money to be made, in the end.
But no, it’s not that all Romanians – not even most of them, not even a big part of them – are the petty thieves and bad seeds like others in Europe believe they are.
Yes, it is true: there are some bad people here. We are uneducated. We generally lack the means to get the lives we feel we deserve and the more you look on the streets, the fewer smiles you can see on the peoples’ faces…
But most Romanians are doing their best to improve their chances, to change something and make their lives better.
Most Romanians are still honest people, good people, hard working people that keep pushing and hoping for a better life.
They would not break the law, they would not do the stupid things that the “others” do, they would just live their life, like any other normal person on this planet.
Not by moving abroad and stealing other people’s possessions. Not by setting camp in parks and occupying derelict buildings – no, those are not all Romanians, those are just a minority. The scum.
I have nothing against people choosing to flee the country. I love to travel and I have considered moving away from Romania for various reasons (and I still do). Good people leave the country just as much as the bad ones do.
Romanians Are Good, Honest People
Living in Romania, I have interacted with a ton of extremely simple people who lived in shocking conditions, who had no running water and no means to own a TV or a fridge or to have EVER eaten at a restaurant.
I have a met a ton of different Romanians and even though some of them were the mischievous creatures Europeans think all Romanians are, most of them weren’t.
They were people whose hands were bleeding at the end of the day because they worked so hard – not to get rich, not to feel good, not because they were forced to, but because they wanted to survive.
Because they wanted a better life and that was the most they could do. They wanted more.
I’ve met an old lady who barely knew how to read because she hadn’t been sent to school – but she still took a newspaper or a silly book for children and spent hours trying to decipher the words there. She wanted more.
I’ve met families of six living in a studio looking at a grim future, and I was extremely impressed when I heard that one of them got a scholarship and went to college to become a doctor or something high brow like this.
I know Romanians who skip a meal or two just to be able to buy their son or daughter books and notebooks for the school. To feed them and send them to learn something, to live a better life than they did.
Some really want more. Some people really do all they can – without breaking the law – to live a decent life. And most, despite their efforts, still get nothing in return.
Others give up the fight. They try something stupid. The easier way out. Sometimes it works, most of the times it doesn’t. You don’t have to live in Ferentari to realize that life gave you one lemon (not even more!)
I lived a very modest life. I grew up in a family where my Grandmother started a business at around 70: she borrowed the equivalent of $50 to buy coffee and pots and started selling coffee to people.
The reason why she started doing this? She wanted to make enough to guarantee that we have enough money to buy bread daily.
Can you imagine this? A 70-year-old grandma waking up each day at 5AM to prepare coffee, just to make sure that she has enough to buy BREAD?
I was lucky to grow up with such a family. To learn this work ethic. To know how it feels to go to sleep on an empty stomach. (Although, truth be told, that rarely happened – but I am sure my parents and grandmother did it just so I won’t)
To see that you never give up and the only thing that stands in your way and success – however you want to measure it is yourself.
Not where you were born, not the deck of cards you were dealt with, nothing else. Bad people will do bad things no matter what.
I grew up surrounded by gypsies. Most of our neighbors were gypsies. Even the small kids were stealing, were swearing and didn’t go to school.
I didn’t follow the same route. Because not all human beings – and specifically not all Romanians are bad.
Not all Romanians are rude, bad people. We are frowned upon by fellow Europeans not because of what we are, but because of what some of us are.
And you know what? Despite all these, despite the fact that we all know that if we go in a Western European country and we admit that we’re Romanians (many have stopped doing so), we’ll be, most likely, frowned upon, we still go there.
We still get better jobs than we would get in Romania and we still manage to live a better life. Or at least some of us do – just like some of us don’t.
Because we want more. Because we’re not all bad.
Don’t rush to judge a person before you actually get to know them. I guarantee you’ll be surprised.
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37 thoughts on “Why Are Romanians Frowned Upon in Europe?”
I’ve lived & worked in Romania for since 2008 full time & been coming here since 2003. My wonderful partner is Romanian, the nanny for my mentally disabled brother in the UK who provides exceptional love & care is Romanian by strange coincidence & my 2 offices with 10 great people are Romanian.
I have as many loves & hates for Romania as any Romanian. The fact is, it remains a great place, despite the people who bring it down. I wholeheartedly agree with ‘C The Romanian’. But there is much more than that.
The good Romanians also need to hang their head in shame too. Whenever I go to any Irish music event, even disco’s strangely, the last song that is sometimes played is the national anthem & almost all Irish blooded people stand tall, straight & proud throughout. A strange sight at 3am in Temple Bar to find a club full of still witnesses.
Romanians do not carry that pride I feel. You can see it in the lack of tourist care, in the litter in the countryside, in the scruffy gardens & privately owned green spaces, in the graffiti & dirt. Bucharest is the only capital in Europe without a Tourist Information office. That tells you a lot.
Also, the average Romanian is not charitable outside his own family. I don’t refer to the gypsy kids at traffic lights, because i am not charitable to them at all. I refer to the disabled people you never ever see on the street. The lack of wheel chair access is not only due to lack of money or ingenuity. Its about a lack of care.
In my humble opinion, for Romania to be respected, as Poland is for example, Romanian’s need to start respecting themselves as a race, their surroundings & their own society. Through that, others will view them with different eyes. Of course I am over generalizing here to make a point. But as I sit here now in London, I see all around me all kind of care initiatives, from helping homeless to helping drug addicts.
When I return to Bucharest next week, is it likely I will find anything like that? Of course not. I like to convince myself it is not about greed & money & that it can be reversed. Am I too idealistic?
Good points, Damian. Fortunately, things started to move in the right direction in this area too, more people have initiatives like the ones described by you and we’re slowly (unforunately not faster) moving in the right direction.
Society is full of stereotyping. Better or worse we live with it. Probably best to focus more ourselves and make sure we are trying to do good. It is all we can do to help fix it. I am american but i am not rich or arrogant as society has labeled me. I go through my day trying to do the “right” thing. The right thing for me is not to buy into the idea that Romanians are thieves. They are not.. some are.. as some are in all countries. Seeing how the media latched onto this like in England was so wrong. We should speak out and do what we can to set it right. The idea that poor Romanians would flood the country.. only the uneducated would believe that you would think. The fact that the politicians and the media used it the way they did is what keeps that stereotyping alive and well and they are the ones that need to be addressed.
Nothing wrong with Romania. What is wrong is what the uneducated believe. What is criminal is how the educated use it to their advantage as they did in England for example.
Well said, Otto! I really enjoyed reading your comment!
You don’t know reality and you’re talking about textbook, I’m living in Ireland for a year and I see a real problem with them.
I meet every day, including lies, thefts, the trash they dump on the streets. I am a Japanese.
The same goes for New York, the United States. It is not a pride of immorality to share a nation, but it is not desirable, but poor and uneducated.
Well I’m surrounded by Romanians and I’ve never met a nice one. Arrogant, loud, incosiderate, rude people.
This is so well written C. Well done!!! I feel you. Being Nigerian, l view how people treat us too in the rest if the world. When you pull out the passport, you get pulled aside. Everyone knows that all Nigerians are scammers right?? People are so quick to paint a whole nation with the same brush. My father, my mom, and the first 5 kids lived in a single room, with a shared outside toilet with the whole building. My dad put up a sheet across 1/3 of the room and used that as his office/storage space for the car spare parts he was selling. He saw the big picture, and did things the right way through hard work and perseverance. He never forgot and when things got better, he used his money to improve so many people’s lives. There are so many more stories like his, but people prefer to think of the few bad apples. The press love to scare people, sells more l guess. I judge people by how they behave, not by their nationality. It’s another reason why l think people should travel more if they can, it really opens your eyes and make you realize how lucky and blessed one truly is when they see the sufferings of others. When your biggest worry is that you have to go all the way to the next mall because this store does not have your shoe size and you complain to the manager etc..you know you have it good! 🙂
Thanks, Kemkem. If I could write in English as well as I can in Romanian, we’d have more well written articles here 🙂
I am always impressed by the stories of people who manage to make it on their own and I believe that people who were not born rich, but made it there (or at least improved their lives a lot) are extremely open minded and should be appreciated for managing to make it on their own. I personally had no idea that Nigerians are also on the “blacklist” as many other nationalities are but I can only hope that slowly we’ll start to understand exactly what you said – we shouldn’t judge people based on the few bad apples, but their behavior.
Thanks for tackling this difficult topic. I know one should never generalize or base one’s opinions on anecdotes… but here goes anyway!
There are veritable palaces, obviously recently built, right in the middle of very small Romanian towns. These were built with the “winnings” of those “Romas” who have gone to Western Europe and engaged in every possible criminal activity to make money. It is a way of life. The most benign of these activities is begging. Small babies are used by their mothers to beg money from Western Europeans. When these babies get older, they are turned into mothers who go begging with their babies. When they get enough children this way, they “retire” back to Romania, living off the “winnings” of their children and they build a palace.
Next anecdote: I often went to a small town where we were renovating a church. We needed some new gutters for the roof and a German local (saş) recommended some Gypsies who had done the gutters of a church in another town. When the Gypsies came to give an estimate for our roof, I wasn’t there and we had failed to warn the other Germans that some Gypsies were coming to give us an estimate. Needless to say, when the Gypsies showed up, the Germans told them to get lost. It was my job to call them up, apologize, and ask them to come back again. They did, gave us an excellent price and they then did an excellent job.
Another anecdote: We visited a Romanian school. The kids were thrilled to have a real, live American in their class. They were so proud of their English, they asked so many good questions. I noticed the dark-skinned children at the back of the class weren’t participating, so I went to the back, shook some hands, and started asking them questions in Romanian. The teacher ran to me and dragged me away, saying, “They’re too stupid, don’t ask them anything.”
Another anecdote: I was in the main plaza in Sibiu when I was approached by a Roma beggar. She asked me in Romanian for some money. I tried to blow her off by saying, “I don’t speak Romanian.” She answered me in flawless English. I then tried German, “Ich verstehe kein Rumänisch.” She answered me in flawless German. Then I tried Spanish, “No hablo la lengua romana.” She answered me in flawless Spanish. Then I tried Italian, “No parlo la lingua rumena.” She answered me in flawless Italian. Finally, I said, “Va rog sa ma lasati in pace.” And she left me.
These are a few of the many anecdotes and stories I collected in Romania. They suggest to me that the Roma are no less intelligent or hard-working than other people. They are just responding to the incentives as they perceive them. As long as Western Europeans give the Roma beggars money, they will be beggars. As long as they are discriminated against in the Romanian school system, they will not rise above their place in Romanian society. I have also met a college-educated Roma who I am proud to call my friend. He is an activist trying to bring life back into a small forgotten Romanian village. Okay, thanks for reading this.
This is indeed a difficult topic and I believe that the Roma situation (one that I am not ready to tackle on its own right now) is different of what I wrote about here. In the end, as I always said, no matter what their situation is, the Roma population in Romania has Romanian nationality and therefore they are all Romanians. “They” are “us” and there shouldn’t be any “them” or “us” 🙂
Thank you for your anecdotes, they certainly show that indeed there are bad apples and great people. It’s easier to generalize, but we shouldn’t.
Regardless of the negatives presented in this blog am thinking of retiring to Romania. Why?
Because i met a lovely woman there and eventually wooed her to form a relationship. I can testify that most Romanians, notably the women, are very polite, charming and caring. As for the men, well all i can say is that they are not Romania’s greatest asset. Enough said.
What i do find annoying is the general Romanian’s habit of camouflaging the truth and reality. This verges on blatant lying and leads to cheating and deliberately misleading . They don’t make friends easily and indulge in the pagan belief that only family and the church can be trusted.
What i find most disgusting about Romanian men is their willingness, or rather eagerness, to put their women and girls to work. This extends into pimping their own sisters, daughters and wives by installing webcams at home for “privacy and decency”.
In fact so many young girls, single and married, do this that it is one of Romania’s most profitable industries. I suspect these sites have some form of government support , i.e. corruption, to “protect” the special interest groups who exploit and operate them.
Romania is fast becoming the Thailand of the Eurozone. Is this good or bad?
I am not a moralist so you can work it out yourself.
You would be surprised to find out that many of these girls do this without being forced by others. There might be some bad apples here and there, but usually men can’t force their wives of sisters or other girls to do things that they don’t want to do. However, it is true that this is a thriving industry and there are a ton of girls who are attracted by the huge earnings (by Romanian standards). It’s just the way some girls manage to make ends meet – it’s easy for them and it pays well. That’s the harsh reality. However, as I said, it’s their choice and not somebody else’s (unless you consider poverty “somebody else”).
I found this article because I have a question about Romanians.. My brother married a Romanian girl and she came to Canada less than a month ago. She was from a working class, not rich, family. She is educated however never had a well paying job.
I was very excited to meet her, and now that she’s here nothing seems good enough. We are a middle class family and my brother provided a nice house. But she only wants to ride in new cars, nothing remotely old in the house, ect.
She is rude to the service industry people and I just generally feel like she expects Buckingham palace or something. But I didn’t write this to vent I want to ask, is this a Romanian mentality or is it her personality? I thought that Romania being many poor that she would be easy to please. Could it be an inferiority complex? Has anyone had this experience?
As a Romanian girl, I assure you this is not Romanian mentality, you can get weeds like this in any country. I am NOT easily pleased because I am a Romanian, or because I was poor. I am easily pleased because I was raised to respect people and work. My advice to you is ignore her.
You are not the one who has to put up with her behavior, your brother is, and my guess is he already knows her well enough that HE decided to marry her. I don’t like the type you described either, I got rid of friends like that because the materialistic type usually is selfish too, and only thinking about themselves.
I’m sorry you got disappointed, you probably expected a new friend, a new sister, and you got someone that thinks about her needs and luxurious comfort before real needs. OR maybe she feels like everything there is yours, because she didn’t choose any of it, and for her to feel like home she wants to put her touch in her new home.
I met 2 Romanian women in my life and they were exactly the same as the one you described: very rude and arrogant, so hard to please, didn’t respect others and in both cases, even though they lived in a dog hole, they had to ride expensive cars. I really want to believe not all Romanian are like that but after what I experienced, I feel like avoiding them.
Ah, yes! The expensive car situation. There are jokes in Romania about people buying $30,000 cars and not having enough money to fill up the tank with gas. Or sleeping in their cars, because they’re more comfortable than their homes.
Again, it is something that only happens with a small amount of the population. Gold diggers and extreme consumerists are everywhere.
sounds like bad luck pall! generally rude
Lynn, I have seen this behavior from other countries where the women grew up poor and then came to the USA. The best way I can explain the reasoning for this behavior is that it is kind of a backlash effect.
Meaning they had been looked down on and/or used for most of their lives and now they are finally in position that is not on the bottom of the totem pole; so they are going exert the attitude on others from which they could never do in their previous status. Like when I have been poor in the past and finally get some money; Sometimes I would spend it foolishly just because I could.
its the same all over the world, hatred breeds hatred, lack of education, ignorance
I understand that you are hurt by this and I agree it’s a horrible situation but please see it differently. Not all of us are the same. We are humans like any other nationality. We are smart and hard working people . Sadly I had to work harder than others so people could recognize my work. That’s why it hurts to see such stereotypes Have a nice day.
I am a Romanian born citizen that was adopted into the US. I am grateful for the life I have been given and am appreciative to the fact I did not have to live with the disparities that are cast amongst my people.
I was born in Nusfalua in 1989, and left at the age of 3. I cringe at the topic of discussion, but as many have said it doesn’t matter where you go there is always the “scum” in the pond. I grew up around these type of Americans, and still see it today. If there is one thing I wish I could do, is to bring what I have learned, respect, hard work and compassion for human life.
I visited Bucharest back in 2008 and was very surprised with how much infrastructure was there. I then visited outside of the city and saw what I would have been subjected to. It also showed me that I am grateful for having the opportunity to see where I came from. I understand that Romania is frowned upon, but the media and others don’t know the fact that Romania was relieved of communism only 30 years ago.
Without the ability to teach the newer generations of the harsh reality that their parents and families went through, I honestly don’t believe that they will understand why parts of Romania are the way they are.
The schooling system, which I am very unaware of sounds like it needs to be updated and processed in a way that shows the younger generations that they have a position to fill. I have been fully educated and am earning a AAS in Science and wish to further extend what I have learned to Romania.
I hope that the economic growth and human growth evolves, but it does take the right people to enhance the thought process on how to enact on these abilities. Also responsibility is needed to be taken. So what if things have been wrong, so what if people have acted impulsively. It only takes the mindset and the ability of forgiveness to move forward.
It’s understandable, your wanting to paint a positive picture of your kinsmen and homeland. Only die-hard multi-culturalists wouldn’t want to do this.
Romanians’ poor reputation existed here (UK) before EU expansion and the TV program you mention. Undoubtedly, that picture was largely based on a stereotype rather than personal experience. However, with around half a million Romanians now in the UK, the impression is borne of peoples’ actual experience and, guess what, the sterotype has proven entirely accurate.
Every nationality and ethnicity has a stereotype. Almost always negative. In London, we have vast experience of different ethnicities and nationalities. Some have managed to shrug off a sterotype whilst others have not. Either way, usually for good reason.
I haven’t been to Romania. I probably would have developed a more positive impression had I done so. My experience has been that economic migrants, Romanians included, are invariably poor ambassadors for their homeland and people. Too often, economic migrants are the least genuine and most greedy people their respective countries have to offer.
I live in Germany. I had terrible experience dealing with Romanians. Almost 90 percent of Romanians I met were cheaters. Most of them took my money and never returned back.
I am a wholesale supplier. I do not care about nationality. But when a fraud happens, I try to find out reason behind it. Almost all of them speak in a similar manner. They talk about why I can trust them and they swear on their children. I was scammed by mostly men young, old, middle aged, almost everyone. Once even a younger single mom who had two children scammed me and then blocked my number.
My business suffered losses mostly from Romanians. Turks were good. Russians were good. No problem dealing with anyone from middle east as well. No problem dealing with Germans. Very honest and straightforward people. Now when I come to know that I am dealing with a Romanian I just politely refuse to do business with them. I wish I knew this before I started my business.
As a Romanian, it pains me to read this. But unfortunately I know first hand that you are not completely wrong. Maybe not 90% are as you describe them, but still a large number.
I also feel sorry for that. I didn’t mean to hurt anyone personally. But it just gets little bit difficult to survive and run your business especially if you are living in a foreign country which is very nice and peaceful but you have to deal with certain unpleasant section of people. Having said that I believe there are many nice Romanians as well and as pointed out by someone in the comment section, economic migrants are not the right representative for the kind people belonging to any country. I hope things get better in Romania. My apologies if I offended any Romanians.
I’m so sad to see this. I have Romanian boyfriend, he lives in Romania and I live in Paris. And it hurts me when people are talking bad about Romanian.. There are lots of thieves here and people say they are Romanians right away as if only Romanians do these kind of things.. like I hope people will stop judging and those thieves have to stop too😞
Well, I can say the thing for Americans. They are frowned upon in Europe too because of their rude behavior. There are times when I see American tourists do stupid things and I’m embarrassed about it.
Granted, this is different. I understand this dislike towards Romanians does stem from the old stereotype from the gypsy community. Which sadly is still going on there. Everyone wants to make a better life from themselves. I have never looked down on the Romanian people. Just the opposite.
I find Romanians to be warm hearted, educated (for the most part), kind and polite. They are willing to share everything they have with you regardless where you are from. In fact, most Americans have a very positive view of Romania and this positive view is spreading elsewhere.
My friend from Sweden, was hesitant to come with me to Romania. Once he did, he loved it. He’s gone back numerous times. He even invited more Swedes to come and they liked it too! Like everything else in life, you need to experience it for yourself before you can form an opinion. I’ll always be a strong supporter of Romania. I country I truly love.
I had absolutely no prejudices against Romanians before meeting a few of them.
I had initially a lot of sympathy towards fellow Europeans with a somewhat similar language.
After having had to deal with about a dozen of them, either professionally or as cotenants, I have to say that I didn’t meet anyone belonging to their group who wasn’t a sociopath, deeply intolerant and/or did not try to take advantage of me.
They had no concepts about friendship, they drink a lot and are both dirty and intolerant. Eg. They showed absolutely no respect for other people needs, total lack of empathy. A dozen people might be a small sample, some of them are bound to be decent people, but I haven’t met any so far.
As colleagues I would describe them as arrogant backstabbers.
This is EXACTLY my experience. I think it’s in their culture to take and not care about anyone else. A million of them showed up in the UK uninvited, but what do they contribute? They just take.
My new neighbors in Canada are Romanians (been in Canada for 15 years), and they’re terrible people, no regard for their neighbors at all. Loud, obnoxious and very anti-social.
I met quite a few Romanians in England, first being a mature student at Uni in the late 90s. From him I learnt a bit about the language being of Latin origin etc. Then here and there I met Romanians; friend’s girlfriend later wife, friends from riding lessons, few people I hired to do some DIY etc- no prejudice or pre-judgements at all until a group of Romanians came to rent the house next to mine 2.5 years ago- I absolutely hate living next door to them- they appear to be middle class as well but sadly they have made me dislike Romanians so much which I know is wrong on my side- I am fighting with myself not to let this dislike grow and not to paint everyone else with the same brush.
I am not English so I totally understand being subjected to a stereotype myself hence why I try so hard not to let these people forever tarnish my thoughts about an entire country. The people next door show zero respect or consideration for anyone. They fill my garden and house up with their chain smoking constantly even when I asked them to please show me consideration.
They have people living there out of rental contract and from what I can see since last year they are constantly at home probably spending taxpayers’ money. I don’t see them of any benefit to the UK. They travel home twice a year as well and drive decent cars they imported with them. I don’t know how they pay the rent as it’s not cheap.
I just want to be free from them and because of them really do not wish to become neighbors with Romanians ever again nor to visit Romania which is something I would have done before- very sorry to say all this as I do know from a logical aspect that you can’t paint millions of people with the same brush but sadly it has been a very unpleasant experience.
This happened to me. I’ve lived happily in a nice little flat in my home town with my wife for 9 years. A Romanian family moved in and it’s been absolutely miserable. Exact same thing – chain smoking, parties until 5/6am, constant noise and music, extra people coming to live there, and when we made noise complaints they knocked on the door saying they can do what they want, they can stop paying rent and there’s nothing the UK courts can do about it. Threatened that they’d get their cousins around if I kept complaining about the noise. I’ve always been quite tolerant and left wing, my father is an immigrant, but they’ve caused this horrible racism to grow inside me and I can’t help it. They are the most vile, inconsiderate, arrogant people you can ever hope to live around.
The real problem is people and society have conflated citizenship with genetics/people/ethnicity/race. Traditionally, countries were a group of people with common genetic ancestry who had borders, language, and culture. Romani people of south Asian ancestry forced their way into Romania over time and the actual genetic Romanians didn’t do enough to expel them. These are not Romanian people just like blacks born or living in France are not French. They may speak French but their genetics are not frank or Gaul.
Due to immigration and colonial bs in the new world, we should be solely discussing race and ethnicity. What are you should mean what are your genes. Then we will have clarity. Then it will be clear who and what everyone is and what groups commit a disproportionate amount of violent crime and what groups are prettiest and have the highest IQs. Real Romanians need to do a better job of emphasizing that ethnic Romanian people are very different than non ethnic people who live or lived in Romania at some point and call themselves Romani.
OK so you’re racist. I don’t care about skin colour, black British people are British people. Romanians are invaders.
Sad and interesting discussion.
I was born and raised in Romania before leaving at the age of 18, more to get away from my mother than to leave the Ceausescu’s realm. My parents were physicians and so were all their friends, my grandparents were teachers in the countryside. All my school friends (and school was tough in those days) were fun, polite and educated.
I stood up for my few Gypsy friends, who never invited me to their homes, and had famous fights with my mom who called them thieves and scum, although she took the same care of their kids, as a pediatrician, as she did of everybody else’s.
My foreign friends loved Romania: good food, friendly people, beautiful country and yes, easy women. There was no crime in Bucharest, except in the outlying areas where the gypsies were, because the communist party employed militia in great numbers, and these guys were not polite nor educated.
All this was during the time Romania had “liberalized” a little following Ceausescu’s support for the Czechs after the Russian’s invaded Czechoslovakia.
I understand that mine was a lucky generation, after the hatred of intellectuals from the 1940’s and 1950’s and before the final craziness of the Ceausescu’s in the 1980’s. Nevertheless, we were still the people who gave the world Brancusi, Eliade, Dada, Eugene Ionescu, Enescu and Henry Cuanda. Oh, and Vlad Tepes as well.
You would have had to be a fool not to recognize that corruption and underhandedness were also part of the tradition that had ensured our survival during the Ottoman and other occupations, but despite all the history, we still speak Romanian, the only romance language in that neck of the woods. This may also be at the root of the way things are today.
To me, the immediate chaos that followed the inappropriate way the Ceausescu’s were killed, without a trial, without bringing to justice any of their
cronies who continued appropriating the wealth and power, is the real reason for the disaster Romania is today. There had been only one way of organizing the people and nothing else was tolerated, so when the organizing principle melted to nothing, and yet nothing changed, it became every man for himself.
A lot, if not most of the professionals left, and – since the borders no longer contained them, so did the gypsies whose numbers had continued to grow rapidly under Ceausescu’s horrific ban on abortions and birth control. I would actually be curious to know what the racial proportions were at the time of the 1989 revolution.
I live in Phoenix AZ nowadays and I lived and went to school in Chicago. I worked and finished college and medical school there, and the Romanians I befriended there were all working and paying taxes; they were physicians, building owners and administrators, nurses. Same thing in Arizona: psychiatrists, nurses, pharmacists, shop and business owners, and IT developers (they tell me Romanian hackers are among the best because the internet is cheap back home).
I guess a people that have survived since the times of the Romans, will continue to survive, but the Romani are not of the same extraction, and they too, survive the best way they know how, to annoy all of us until the next dictatorship…
As an American, I can say that we too have a bad reputation in Europe. “The Ugly American”. Ignorant of other cultures, rude to the people we meet overseas, criticizing things we do not understand. When I travel, I do everything I can to be a good American. I do get embarrassed when I see fellow Americans acting less than polite. All it takes a few Americans to do stupid things to stain all of us. So I imagine this is the same for Romanians. I have never thought badly of the Romanian people. In fact, just the opposite. I’ve never met a more friendly, more generous, and compassionate people in my travels. Granted, most Europeans I’ve met are all friendly. But I find Romanians to be special. When they talk to me, they have a genuine interest in knowing why I am visiting their country. They seem amazed that an American wants to travel there, let alone move there!
When I’m here in California, I do my best to try to educate people about Romania. They are fascinated why I travel there so often. So I tell them all about the good things. I mention the bad things too, but overall, most everyone comes away a with positive impression of your country and the people.
From an English perspective it’s because there are TOO MANY of you here! Sorry but when most immigrants came to Britain they integrated, Romanians have flooded in pretty much uninvited in such huge numbers that it’s caused problems. They don’t really integrate, they just stick in their own communities and take over whole areas, and we’re expected to say “oh how lovely!” My Romanian neighbours have been here 7 years, can barely speak English and cause all sorts of problems because they think it’s perfectly acceptable to have loud parties until 5/6am, and when people complain they get all aggressive. Farage was right. Worst people to live around.